Farmer’s Market Strategies w/ Catt Fields-White: On Pricing, Scaling & When to Walk Away
(Listen on Apple or Spotify. Full transcript below.)
Farmers markets offer food founders the chance to capture high margin sales —but it only matters if you know how to make them profitable.
In this episode, Sarah sits down with Catt Fields-White, nationally recognized farmers market expert and founder of the InTents National Farmers Market Conference, to answer real questions from Good Food CFO listeners about maximizing farmers market revenue.
What You'll Learn:
Why Catt told one cookie vendor to raise prices five times before adding production capacity
The margin advantage of farmers markets vs. wholesale distribution (and why it matters for cash flow)
Logistics for selling at 7+ markets weekly: staffing, delivery, and storage solutions
Simple display changes that directly impact sales (including the pricing psychology most vendors miss)
What to do before walking away from an unprofitable market, and more
Thinking about launching, growing or revamping a farmer’s market business?
This episode is for you!
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Episode Timeline
00:00 Welcome Back and Audience Questions
03:04 Maximizing Farmers Market Sales
05:54 Effective Market Strategies
08:54 Selling at Multiple Farmers Markets
11:46 Logistics of Multiple Markets
14:37 Vendor Best Practices
17:33 Evaluating Market Viability
20:12 Community Connection and Profitability
23:26 Building Relationships with Market Managers
25:59 Farmers Market Forum and Future Plans
29:05 Advocacy for Small Farmers
31:42 Closing Thoughts and Conference Details
Full Episode Transcript
You're listening to the Good Food CFO podcast. I'm your host, Sarah Delevan, and with us as always is our producer, Chelsea Stier. Hey, Chelsea. Hey, Sarah. We are back with season 16 of the podcast today, and we're also back to weekly episodes for most of the rest of the year. Yeah, summer's officially over, and while you and I and the rest of our team will be
very busy still for the rest of the year. We're now past a very big milestone. Yeah, just this morning, Friday, October 3rd, we released the beta version of our software to our members. So we're officially in the beta testing phase and just weeks away from the official
broad launch of the software. So it's a very big day. If you're watching the podcast on YouTube, we are donning our new Good Food CFO hats. And it's super exciting. Yeah, it was a really great event that we had this morning. I thought that was awesome. Everybody was so excited to kind of log in and start getting their profile set up and dive right in. And I really just want to take a moment and say like, A,
Sarah, congratulations. I know that this is something that you have been dreaming of for many, many years. So the fact that today is here is a really big deal. And also I want to say congratulations to everyone listening because you are on the precipice of having access to some amazing financial strategy tools. thank you, Chelsea. It sort of doesn't feel real, even though we've achieved this big
big milestone. And perhaps that's because there is still work to do, you know, to get it officially ready for everybody, but to see the software doing what I imagined and then some and to see people using it today and rapidly diving in and sending their feedback, you know, the, like this or I would be great to see this, you know, it's exactly what we want. The process is, as you said, going to
like really create an amazing tool for all of the founders in our broader community. And yeah, thank you because it has been a dream for over seven years to make this a reality and this is the perfect time. So we'll keep you updated as things continue to progress. And I don't think I pointed this out yet, but my background might look a little different if you're watching on YouTube. And that's because Sarah, I'm in your dining room right now.
Yeah, we've been together. Keisha was here earlier this week, our VP of operations for those of you who haven't had the chance to meet her yet. Working together, we tend to try to get together each September and we made that happen this year in LA for the launch of the beta testing. So I'll see you in a couple of minutes in person again, Chelsea. I'm in my office with the door closed. Yeah. So very exciting stuff today. But Sarah, I want to get back to today's episode.
We get several questions around here from our listeners, and we had quite a few recently around selling locally, maximizing sales at farmers markets, how to be successful in farmers markets. We knew exactly who to invite to answer those questions. That is Kat Fields-White of Farmer Market Pros. Yeah. Kat Fields-White is the founder and CEO of Farmer's Market Pros.
One of my favorite organizations that is promoting financial sustainability, community engagement and entrepreneurship for small businesses at farmers markets, not only in the US, but in Canada and beyond. Kat has traveled. She is really preaching all the value that farmers markets can provide to communities all over the world. They have an online vendor 101 course.
that helps prepare food makers for market success. hosts the Intent National Farmers Market Conference now in its 10th year, which brings farmers, market managers and makers together to gain the skills and the tools they need to really aid their market operations. And of course, Catt is the co-host of Tent Talk, the weekly farmers market podcast for the people inside the tents and the online farmers market forum community, which is relatively new and Catt shares a little bit more about.
inside the episode. I want to take a moment to say that the 10th annual Intents Conference is happening March 1st through 4th, 2026. You can reserve your ticket now and you can also submit a proposal to present at the conference. And I want to talk about this because one of the unique things about Farmers Market Pros, as I mentioned a moment ago, it's for both vendors, right? Prepared food, farmers, and also farmers market managers.
and they curate a really interesting and well-rounded group of speakers. So if you have a passion for designing farmers market tables and you've got a knack for it and you've seen an increase in your sales, that's a perfect presentation for the group. If you're great at building community at your farmers market and beyond, that's an amazing presentation, right? So whether you're a manager or someone who's selling behind the table,
someone who's passionate about something related to farmers markets and their success, I encourage you to go to their website. shares it at the end of the episode and submit a proposal to be a speaker. It is really one of my favorite conferences of the year. Yeah. You've definitely talked about that before, how much you love that conference and how much it kind of like fills your cup, right? Every time you get to go.
I know every time you've gone that we've had a meeting after or talked after, you're just always like smiles ear to ear. have so many good stories. And I know that you and Kat had a lot to talk about in this episode itself. So what do you say we take a quick break and then we jump into the conversation? Yeah, let's do it.
Over 70 % of early stage food brands fail due to cashflow issues, incorrect pricing and thin margins. The Good Food CFO breaks through that noise. Partnering with founders from pre-revenue through their first million in sales, we have created a first of its kind financial software that is designed to teach you to understand your numbers, price for profit and make confident financial decisions that support long-term sustainability.
The Good Food CFO's proven framework is helping good food businesses thrive. Your business is next. For a limited time, you can head to the goodfoodcfo.com and join the wait list to receive 50 % off your first month's subscription. Now back to the show. Hi, Kat. Welcome back to the podcast.
Sarah, it's nice to be back. We'll have to have you come over to ours too.
I would love that. You know I would love that. I'm looking forward to the next intense conference too already. I know it's months away, but I'm very excited.
We're already working on it. So you'll be getting our little RFP farm and we'll figure out where we're plugging you in. And people were so excited to have you there this year.
It was so fun. And I'm going to hang around for longer. It was really sad. I kind of popped in and popped out. this time I'll be there a little bit longer. Oh, that's great. Yeah. But I'm excited to have you back because as you may know from listening to the podcast yourself, we often say to our audience, let us know if you have questions. Send your questions to us. And we got a number of questions from our audience about farmers markets, maximizing farmers market sales, how to be successful at farmers markets. And we were like, obviously, we're going to have to have Kat back to answer these questions because who better?
than you to do it. we've got the three questions that came in from our audience that I want to start with. And then we'll just kind of take the conversation from there. Anything else that you think, you know, needs to be added for context, obviously share away. So number one, the first question that came in is how can food brands maximize local farmers market sales? And I
At first I was like, well, that seems like maybe it's obvious, but I think it's not. And I want to say before you answer that I've learned from farmers market pros that it goes beyond the market itself. The market itself is not responsible for drumming up all of the sales for its businesses in the market. And there are things that the brands themselves can do. And the reason I say that is because I've heard people complain like, this is a quote unquote bad market or
So maybe you can address the idea of a good market or a bad market as well as what brands can do.
Sure. So I think it's a little bit like if you think about having a retail store in a mall. Absolutely. do a ton of marketing. Any effective farmers market manager is doing a ton of marketing to get people to the street and in front of your booths. whether you're in a small market where you've got a fairly tightly curated group of vendors or you're in a very large market, I work with a of very large markets where there's 150, 200 tents on the street.
You you may be curated in there probably somebody's vetted you to make sure you're a really strong brand before you get in the mix But so are the other hundred and forty five tenths around you So you still have to do the work to stand out to the customers that are on the street there and also if you're smart about it to take those customers with you wherever else you may go so there's a few things you want to do if you're on social media one of the things I keep saying I'm going to do a marketing presentation at some point where I just walk out on stage and I say hey
Put your location, including the city and state, on the profiles of your social media accounts. And then I'm just going to drop the mic and walk away because that's all you need to do. I see so many folks that have these really intriguing products on Instagram and they'll say, see you at the farmers market this week, but they don't say a word about what city or state they're in. So folks have no idea. And maybe somebody's got the energy and the curiosity to click around a few times and go to your website and then maybe search on the
five pages down into your contact list, because a lot of people do it on their websites too, and find out where you are. But maybe they don't. People are easily distractible. So make it easy for them. Tell them where you are. If you're operating at farmers markets, by definition, you're moving around. You're in a different place each day. Tell people that. We see a lot of very active farmers market vendors that never mention on their own website or their social media posts where they're going to be on Tuesday versus where they're going to be on Thursday or Saturday.
Let people find you. They've probably tasted you in one place. They want to follow you to where you are, but you got to tell them where that is because you're moving around. In terms of display at the market, having a tent that has a very catchy product name on the front of it that doesn't say anything about what you sell, you're taking the chance that people are not going to work their way through the crowd to cross over to that side of the street and land at the front of your booth. We strongly recommend that you do a fairly shallow banner on the front of your booth that says something like,
just baked bagels or best jam ever. And then on the larger banner in the back of your booth, that's where your logo and the photos and the wonderful information about where else to find you comes in. But make yourself stand out in that aisle by being very, very clear about what it is that you're selling.
Yeah, I want to pause just for a second. Last year at the Intense Conference, I sat in on a workshop. It was given by a gentleman. can't remember his name, but he was really talking about, you know, walk the market as a customer during a busy time so you can see what people can't see, right? Or what they see when they're approaching your booth. So I love the banner advice. And then he also talked about, you know, which direction or directions your product is facing. So as someone's walking a certain way, you
through the market as a whole, they can actually have the opportunity to see your product, you know, from this corner or that corner.
We always recommend that. We had Ali Ball at the conference a few years ago too and she said the same thing, get on the outside of your booth when you've set up and look at how that's set up and stand across the street and look at how it's set up. How easily can they tell what you're selling? When they get there do you have one empty space on the table where somebody can set their shopping bag down so that they get ready to fill it with your products? There's a lot of things you can do to make it easier for shoppers and more inviting for them. Strongly recommend in your display.
You're probably thinking about Ben who's from the cider company in Pennsylvania. Yes the conference. Yes, that is amazing. He has a lot of good tips about display. But one of the things you want to do absolutely bottom line is put the price on every one of your products on your display. People would rather die than be embarrassed. There's all kinds of psychological studies about that. Yeah. So they don't want to ask you what the price is. And if they do ask and it's too high, they're going to do one or two things. One, they're just going to say.
can't really afford this, didn't want to spend that much, but I'm going to buy it anyway because I don't want to be embarrassed by saying I can't afford it or indicate in any way that it's too much. So they'll buy it, but they'll never come back. Or they're going to be embarrassed and say, I can't afford that today, moving on. Maybe I'll come back to you next week, but they probably won't because you've created that discomfort. So having prices on your products at markets makes a huge difference in how much you sell.
think too, as someone who shops the market pretty much every week, I hate to stand and try to get someone's attention to ask the price or if they've got a long line, now I have to get in that line to get to them to then figure out if I want it or not and then, hey, Nate, yeah, we're going to take it. You know what I mean? It's like, yeah, make it easy because if I have to wait or if it becomes a roadblock to purchasing to even get the price, I'm likely just going to move on.
to somewhere else, especially if I've never had it before.
For sure, and that's something, it's kind of a, if you worked in a retail setting, you might know this, but if you haven't, you don't, and if your staff hasn't, they don't. But when we train people in retail settings, we used to work with lot of restaurants and small retailers, we would teach the folks behind the counter to put people on hold just like you would on a phone. So if you're a busy receptionist and you pick up the phone but you can't take it, you say, can you hold for just a second, I'll be right back to you, and then you go back to your other call? You can do that in person at your booth. You can...
make eye contact and acknowledge that person and say, I'm going to wrap up. Just one second. I'm going to take care of these folks and I'll be right with you. That keeps them engaged. That'll keep them in line. That'll keep them looking at your products. yeah, but it is, you got to juggle if you've got a busy booth going on. Yeah. Yeah. If you're talking about people saying that they've had a market that isn't working for them, you do have to be selective about which market you choose. So I would suggest when you're talking about walking the market, that you do that before you ever apply.
Are there a whole lot of vendors already in your basic category? There's a lot of markets that can't find a great spice mix vendor, but there's some that have three already. So where do you want to be? You might want to be in that one that doesn't have any. Look around at what kind of demographic are you seeing? Are you seeing people buy a lot of fruits and vegetables?
they will be interested in your spice mixes or your sauces? Or are you mostly seeing people that are there checking out the jewelry and the craft section up at the top? So you want to get a feel for what people are buying at that market. So choosing the right market to begin with is half the battle. And that doesn't always mean the largest market. Sometimes it means a market that just has your people at it. Do you want to find the market that's really appealing to the folks that align with what you're selling? Yeah.
Yeah, I love that too, because here in LA, we've got huge markets and we've got tiny, I mean, they're all neighborhood markets, but like, you know, little pocket neighborhood markets and, you know, being close, like having the people who can walk to the market, I think is a great thing, especially here in LA, but they're not the biggest markets, but
I think the creators do a great job of getting a good mix of people. So you can certainly go and get everything you need from your spices to your butter and dairy to your produce and even a bottle of wine at some of them, which is really fun.
Yeah, it's very cool. We're allowed in California now, we can host wine if it's the farmer that's grown the grapes. In other parts of the country, I'm in Philadelphia part of the time and the markets there, they can host distilleries and they can host a lot of cider makers and they can host a lot of wineries even if they're not necessarily growing the grapes. So we see a lot more of that at farmers markets now.
I love that. Okay, let's move on to the next question. And this carries on with sales, but it's more about how you can sell at multiple farmers markets within the state that you are in. just as a recap for you, Kat, most of the listeners of this podcast have businesses that they want to keep local and regional. They want to be reaching people in farmers markets and don't necessarily want to go into
quote unquote traditional retail stores or brick and mortars, but they need perhaps more sales than what a single market can generate for them. What kind of tips or advice do you have for someone who's thinking about venturing into multiple markets in their area?
Well, we actually see a lot of folks and certainly I get that I You're preaching to the choir and as as somebody in the meeting I was in yesterday said the choir still needs to practice Yeah Getting the full retail price by selling in farmers markets is so advantageous versus sometimes when you're scaling anybody that's listened to your podcasts or followed you knows that there's a lot of hidden expenses involved when you're wholesaling and distributors prices and slotting fees and
all those things that really change what your bottom line is as far as what you're netting. So, markets are a great place. If you're going to be in a lot of markets, you've got two choices. You can be in up to seven markets a week, you yourself, the maker, standing in the booth and being at one market a day. And you can probably do that in most areas now. Mondays are a little iffy, but I would say any significant size city probably has markets Tuesdays or Sunday on a regular basis. So you could do that.
And then your other option, of course, is to be in even more markets and possibly not be on your feet quite as much by hiring a staff. And so we do a lot of work in our organization with teaching people who are very creative makers, powerful founders, possibly not experienced at hiring or managing staff people. We do a lot of work to help them figure out what the best methods are for hiring a staff and retaining a staff.
Yeah, training people thoroughly so that they're not embarrassed if a customer asks them a question that they don't know how to answer. Encouraging your folks to wear some kind of logo branded shirt so they look like they're part of a team. Absolutely making somebody understand that it's important to show up on time and be fully set up when the market opens and be there till the minute it closes making sales. So there's a lot of things you can do to
hire, train, and motivate staff members. And that's certainly the way to cover a lot of markets. We have some vendors in the markets that I'm still involved with managing that are in 14, 20 markets a week. But it's because they have a great team that works together and can cover a wider geographic area.
Yeah. Can we talk about the logistics of being in multiple markets? I had a former client who primarily sold in farmers markets and their biggest hurdle and something that just seemed like a constant problem that couldn't be solved was, well, number one, they had lots of markets in one day. And so that was a big part of it, right? But it's like, how do we get all of the products and all of the things to all of the markets, you know?
that are spread out over the city and, you know, is it a delivery person? Is it individuals taking the product? Like, how do we set that up and structure it? Do you teach maybe like anything about how to figure that out, how to figure out what your system should be, how to figure out how to schedule your markets in your area, anything like that?
Yeah, actually that would make a good class. Now that you're mentioning it, we haven't done that as a specific class. We have worked with individual clients to help them figure that out. And that's exactly the type of thing a lot of times you'll see at the Intense Conference or we've got a new group, Farmers Market Forum, where we're covering some things like that. There's a very clever guy back in New York who picks up things from farms all over upstate and brings them to the New York City markets where it's very difficult to park and very difficult to get.
trucks in full of product but they come and drop sometimes a pallet in a very large market or a smaller group of boxes at markets and then the staff folks walk over to that market or take the subway or the bus as one does in New York City and they arrive and the products are there and we see the same thing with a lot of vendors where we will see the staff people show up at various markets and then we'll see a truck that comes around that starts at the earliest market and then hits the next one and the next one and the next one dropping things off for the staff to set up.
I think there's a lesson to market managers, isn't really your audience, providing storage where somebody could keep a tent and tables and display things through the week and just pick them up on the day on the market would be really helpful to vendors. I have not seen anybody do that yet. We'll have to start encouraging that. That would certainly help it. But so 10 by 10 back in New York City does it as a service. what we've
see with individual vendors is it's typically a vendor that's doing multiple markets. When you're doing that many markets, your business is a little bigger, you have a few more employees, and assigning one of those folks to being the person that knows how to drive that big truck and can get in and out of various markets and drop off the inventory to a staff member that may be coming from somewhere else and setting up is probably the most efficient way to do it. And we do see people manage markets that way. The other thing we've seen lately is a lot of people using really small box trucks.
and keeping everything on the truck. And their whole team, obviously you have to be at a certain point where you've got the money to invest in those vehicles, but their whole team comes out with these adorable trucks that are painted and gorgeous. And they're showing up at markets and they've got everything on them. They just show up and pick up their truck and there they go with their freezers loaded and their jars stacked and get there and slide right into place.
cute. Gosh, driving a box truck. That brings up memories. did that for a couple years. Not for the faint of heart, would say, especially parking that thing and pull up to the market praying that I could just pull in and wouldn't have to parallel park. I got good at it, but I never liked it.
I bet you got good at getting there early because the last thing you want to do is pull in with a truck or a trailer when all the other tents are set up right around you and you have to...
Yeah, gosh, no. Yeah, yeah, I wake up early, wear a lot of hats. I have a hat on today, wore a lot of hats in my farmer's market days. You just crawl out of bed early as you can. Yeah, get there early. Keep your sanity. Don't hit any tents. Yeah. Yeah, 10 by 10, we had him on the podcast. It really interesting. But I also want to encourage the listeners, I like this tip, ask your market manager, like, hey, is this something we could do? Is this something you could consider to store?
some things here. I know out here when I was managing farmers markets, we had a couple Kaiser Permanente locations, which is a hospital. So obviously, there's physical infrastructure there. And the management team was able to store our tents there throughout the week. But then we also had things like the buckets and some accessories, let's say, that our farmers wouldn't bring every single week that could also be stored there. So if it was a windy day, which it generally wasn't,
but we had things that we could provide to the farmers. And so just even that as the market manager, being able to show up and very quickly get my own tent set up and be available to the people who needed me, the farmers coordinating everything, that was really convenient. So I love that tip and start asking your market managers maybe, I don't know.
Yeah, sometimes the site is, yeah, the site sometimes would be really challenging for that. A lot of markets don't have a physical space for storage, but more and more do because more of the permit requirements for markets are requiring them to have a little bit more permanent infrastructure somewhere very, very nearby. So it's something that they could look at. And I would imagine vendors that have multiple markets that they're servicing could even, you know, might be interested in paying a little bit for that storage fee and mitigating the costs of the market manager providing that.
In terms of applying to multiple markets, so if you want to sell in multiple markets in your area, it's always funny because people will approach us, we have a very nebulous, we're San Diego markets in San Diego, so it sounds like we do all the markets. So people will fill out an application and say, I want to be in this and this and this. We're like, well, we manage two of those. Those other four are not our markets. We are seeing more and more regional market groups. So there's a managers group in San Diego that's all the San Diego market managers. And I just saw pictures from a picnic.
of market managers in LA County where they were all getting together and talking. So, and there's a group in Chicago that's the Chicago Farmers Market Collective and they have a central inquiry form online on their website where a vendor can go in and apply and say, I'm interested in these areas, this is what I sell, kind of give us basic information. And then that's dispersed to all the market managers in that area. Because typically it's been, you have to fill out a completely separate application for every single market.
hunt down the market manager and find out where you deliver that application and get it done that way. But we are seeing some more regional cooperation where market managers are trying to make it easier for folks to apply once, indicate which markets they're interested in. Now I will say in that scenario, if you're somebody that's shown up at the last minute or calling out last minute or something, now all those market managers know that about you.
You wanna...
If your market managers are cooperating, you want to be sure and be that shining star that they're sharing enthusiastic information about and not a nice product by that guy, so high maintenance. So make sure that you're building that reputation that's being passed around as a good reputation.
Yeah. Well, I think that's an interesting question that that comment brings up is like, how can you be a good farmers market vendor? What does that look like?
It's observing all the rules so that we don't have to do it for you We just had an inspector this morning at our markets from the AG department and they typically the AG in this area the AG department oversees the farmers the health department oversees the Non-farm vendors, okay But in this case the AG department was there specifically to look for non-farm vendors or farm vendors that were using the word organic without being certified because that's a word that's owned by USDA and you can't use it without certification
So they had three non-farm vendors, jam vendor, somebody selling lotion actually, and then I think, might have been a bakery, but they had organic on their signs. They didn't have any organic certification, and so they were pulling it off. Well, that also creates a violation for the market because our manager should have noticed that and made him pull that off their signs. So being aware of requirements, regulations, and following those makes you good.
If you're just applying as a new vendor, filling out your application completely will get you much better response and indicate that you're a vendor that understands, watching out for the details. If you don't do that, if you leave a bunch of things blank, we're going to go, okay, well, if they can't figure out how to answer all 16 of these questions, how often are they going to forget their tent weights? So, you know, it's indicating an attention to detail. It's arriving on time, honestly. It's a big...
problem for the market if you arrive late or if you start to break down early because that affects shoppers perceptions of whether or not we're open and ready and that affects the sales of the other vendors in the market so you're not just limiting your own sales by not being ready and able to sell through all those hours but by giving the customers the impression that this market isn't organized and that maybe they're not ready to go or maybe they're closing up early. that kind of thing.
Being, you know, playing nicely with others, so being respectful and encouraging to your fellow vendors and to the team members that are managing the market, certainly to the inspectors. You cannot want to fight with a health inspector, heads up. So all of those things will make you a vendor people like to deal with.
Yeah, that's great advice. Okay, this is one of my own questions. Not long ago, we had someone in our CFO office hours that was really contemplating, like pulling out of the local farmers market. And she was having a really hard time with the decision because she liked the connection to the community. She wanted to be emotionally and mentally, right? Like part of that farmers market community. But when she looked at her numbers,
as far as like, what are we selling week to week? What is it costing me? The farmers market channel for her business wasn't profitable. And so she had a lot of, you know, she went to the numbers to make the decision and ultimately decided that for her, she could be part of the community through other local events where she could interface with people one on one. And in another instance, I believe she was like more of a like once a month vendor, right, as opposed to like a week to week vendor.
But, you know, it was difficult for her, but the decision at the end of the day was, can't keep doing these markets the way that I have been. So I think this is an important question to ask is like when you're looking at farmers markets as a revenue stream and you're trying to figure out that big question of like, what should I charge for my product? And then how many units do I need to sell to make this make sense for me as a business? Do you?
have any specific advice for like where people should start with this or options that maybe people would consider if they're feeling like this isn't working for me instead of leaving farmers markets in my area altogether, maybe what are some things that I can do.
Yeah, and I would have had so many questions about that from her. for instance, if she is sounds like maybe the weekly thing was a hard time for her and so she preferred a shorter schedule. I'm wondering if she had already done that before she pulled out. Was she trying to schedule every other week? Was she calling out of markets because she's busy in the production?
I know that she was still attending every single week. Yeah.
I would probably ask your market manager if there's something that they see that you're doing that might help your sales, but certainly there are situations where either because of the specific market that you're in or your product, it's just not going to work for you. And every once in a we'll have somebody pull out of a market and they're so apologetic and they're so sad because they have friends there, either fellow vendors or shoppers or whatever, but they're not making money and they're apologizing. And I'm always know you have to make money at this. Please do not be here just for fun.
That's not fair to you and it's not fair to your fellow vendors. This needs to be profitable for you. But a lot of times the market manager can see things that are happening in your booth that maybe you don't know. You've got a staff person there and you don't know that they're on their phone most of the time. Maybe there's something about your display that you think is aesthetically gorgeous but that we know is not going to help you sell. So a lot of times your market manager can make suggestions. If you're looking at a reduced schedule like in every other week schedule.
If you want a monthly schedule, you're probably way better off to just do annual events that happen once in a while. Monthly does not attract farmers market customers because they're oftentimes they're weekly and you're on their shopping list. And if you're not there, if they're frustrated and they will go to someone else and lose the habit of coming to you.
You do absolutely have to follow somebody like you, Sarah, and make sure that you're costing correctly. We see a lot of folks in farmers markets still to this day, no matter how many times we encourage them and you encourage them, that when they're setting their prices, they're looking at their costs, but they're not taking into account their own time. And that's a key part of your costs for both production and for sales if you're selling consumer direct. So make sure that you're pricing correctly. Oftentimes at farmers markets, we see people charging too little.
We have, I think you've met Maya, Matson from Maya's Cookies, and she started at Farmers Markets, and when she started, she would continually be selling out a third of the way or a half of the way through the time that the Farmers Market was open. And she said she had had other market managers say, oh, well, you need to make more. And that's not what we said. What we said is you need to raise your price. Yeah. Right. Before you think about producing more, raise your price. say, oh, nobody's going to pay more than this for a cookie. We're like, I bet those are good cookies. Raise your price. She did.
We went through this four or five times with her until she got to a price point where it really made sense. She had inventory all the way through the market. She was making lots more money so then she could produce more, get more staff, get into more markets. She actually was just told by her fractional CFO that what she sold online and what she sold in, she's opened a couple of little retail shops were good, but did not have the margin that she had at farmers markets. He told her, back to more markets. Now that you have your pricing figured out.
you're making better money there than you are anywhere else. So if your pricing is correct and your display is correct and your frequency is correct and maybe you want to do six markets, maybe you want to do two markets really well, you should be able to make money there. And if you're not, you should sell in other ways. Don't drive yourself crazy. Maybe the market is just not the best spot for you.
I want to say there's lots of reasons that someone might choose not to be a part of a farmer's market and they're valid and they're fine. But if you want to be part of the local markets and you want to make it work, Kat, you've given really great advice and I'm going to sum it up by saying you have to do the work. I worked with somebody when I was doing food sourcing at a catering company and he would say all of the time, it's called work for a reason.
Right? Like it's not inherently easy. It's not like sit back and put your feet up. It's like, and I think I've learned over the last really seven months of this year is like, if I want to be successful, and I think this is the case for a lot of people, we have to put ourselves out there and ask what is not working. What can I do better? If we're not, if we're having the outcomes we want, still ask that question. But if we're trying to change something, find a coach, find a
consultant, find a market manager, right, who can help you and say, hey, things are going okay here for me or things are not going so great here for me. Can you help me figure this out? Do you have any suggestions? What could I be doing differently or better? Don't be afraid of feedback.
Market managers love to hear that from vendors. We hate to see somebody just kind of fade away because they can't figure it out when they're doing something so obvious. We walk a really delicate line between getting up in your business and just being your host, your landlord of the market. Most of us would love to help incubate businesses and love to nurture people along and we do a lot of that, but you kind of have to ask because otherwise it's really not our business to tell you how to run your business.
but any manager that's been in it for a while has developed some insights about what works and what doesn't work and maybe just a couple of changes you could make that would change that whole operation. If you are enjoying being at the market and you do have a product that you like and you've got production figured out, they might be able to give you a couple of tips that'll make it really financially beneficial.
Yeah, love it. Okay, tell our listeners everything that you all have going on because I know you have a new forum. I know you recently moved to Substack like we did. So I don't even know if I've gotten the full update on everything that you've got going on.
It's wild, right? And it was so funny because we had worked for so long on this sub-stack thing. Actually, my whole thing had been working on some sort of a membership slash community that we could offer to folks because a lot of folks asked us for more classes and some short classes and maybe some lives and that kind of thing. And I looked around for a long time at where to put it. It got very close to school.
Because Molly that because Molly balance is there and I love what she does and yeah I know that she thinks through things really well But it turned out that for me sub stack solved a bunch of things like I wasn't loving the monkey mail platform And I thought sub stack would let let us do a few other things we have a very active private Facebook group I'm not loving Facebook or the whole meta environment and I think that at some point we're probably
likely to have to move from there for one reason or another. so Substack seemed like a good spot where we could put out the weekly newsletter with the opportunity for people to respond to it. I've always kind of disliked the idea that we write a weekly newsletter that goes out into the void. And sure, people could email us and make comments, and once in a while they do. But that's different than a live comment on something you've just written and the opportunity to have those conversations start. So we have moved.
our newsletter and we are gradually kind of moving a lot of our community stuff over to Substack. It's called FarmersMarketForum.com. You can from there it hops over to what is my Substack but that's how we branded it. So that's a really good place to be. We would love to see people there. Obviously you can subscribe for free if you want to subscribe and pay a little bit to be in there. We love you for that. That's a great thing.
That's actually gotten a little traction fairly quickly, but it's not a million dollars. know, it's a couple thousand bucks a year was where it is now. We've only been over there for a month and somebody said, well, that's not a ton of money. I said, you know what? I've been writing anywhere from one to four because we write a newsletter for each of our farmers markets. said, I've been writing one to four newsletters a week for almost 18 years now. Nobody's ever paid me a dime for that. So whatever anybody wants to throw at me on some stack, bonus points for me. And then we have a little bit deeper.
Level of membership you can sign into there that will get Get your access to live calls and to some mini classes and some things that will be be doing there We're coming up on our 10th anniversary of the intense National Farmers Market Conference last year We brought back the makers and farmers track for that in addition to the very large group of farmers market managers from across the US and Canada and a few folks from the UK that usually show up live and in person in San Diego
There's also an option to tune into that conference virtually. So we'll still be doing that. I was just at a meeting though of market managers about a specific program that we're all in. And there were so many people there saying, you know what? I've done it virtually the last couple of years, but I really want to come in person because there's just nothing like being next to people who understand what you do. So what's on stage is important, but what's in the seats next to you can teach you just as much. It's so exciting.
Yeah, congratulations on 10 years. know personally, whenever I am there, physically, I come back so rejuvenated. Like, I have a clear mission and purpose in what I do, but being surrounded by farmers market managers, by folks who sell in their markets, you know, week, every week after week after week, I come back going, yeah, yeah, A, we're all doing this together, right? You're not alone at your computer. You know what mean? It's like,
The network is huge. The movement is and has been so large. And to be all together in one place, there's nothing like it. I always leave so excited and meeting new people, like friends from across the country. You know what I mean? I think it's, it is my favorite conference to attend. I shared on a podcast in, what is it, March or April, I went to Expo West and then I went to Intense in the same week, basically.
And I would much rather spend my time at the intense conference. think, you know, we believe in real food, right? And so to see juxtaposed against one another a few days apart, the amount of money and attention and the quote unquote products that were in Anaheim versus what people are doing and creating and building in San Diego and, know, at your conference.
I mean, how do we get more money to farmers markets? How do we get more money to these small vendors? That's one of the reasons that the software we're creating exists. Yes, to help individual businesses, but if we can track the data anonymously for multiple food businesses, whether you're a rancher, a fisher, a CPG brand that's local and regional, and we can show that
profitability, we can show sustainability. There's so much power in that. So that's a big overarching mission. And I want to say that I really think that being at the conference in March and having gone to Expo West, now that I think back on it, that was the seed planted in my brain. We do need people who are willing to spend three, four dollars a pound on broccoli and two dollars a pound on zucchini and for those people selling that product to be able to.
earn a comfortable living and to continue what they're doing.
Absolutely, and we're so we don't have anything official outside of farmers market forum and the conference and such but we're also working very closely with a lot of groups that are doing advocacy because the environment right now for the larger financial support of small farmers and small very small businesses makers food makers and things is really Suffering right now as we all know that the federal supports for it the regional food centers that were just blooming and
and providing so many incubation points for small food makers, all of that funding was cut very suddenly. not just, it wasn't just a matter of you may or may not agree that things should be federally funded or grant funded or what have you, but the promise is broken for grants that were already in place, money that people had already spent that were supposedly contracted to be able to submit for reimbursement that just evaporated very suddenly has been tragic.
It had a really big effect on the local food system and on whole minimally processed foods. We're working a lot with advocacy. A big push this whole last year has been our Speak Up for Farmers Markets program and theme. And we've really seen it work. We had some talks at the conference earlier this year explaining to folks what they could do on a tiny micro level of every time you see a post on social that says something that clearly
Illustrates if people don't understand the financial difference you make when you shop at a farmers market pop in there and make a comment Do you can do ads that point out that food that you buy at farmers markets? Lasts longer than food that you buy at big-box stores because it hasn't been stored before it's purchased So you can say those things and we have seen just some brilliant campaigns coming out of just single market manager and their social media assistant kind of people that are putting together terrific things that are getting it out to people and
and making them understand. always say even my foodiest friends who shop at farmers markets a lot of times have no idea what a financial impact they're making on those small makers and those small farmers when they buy direct versus buying even the same exact product from a big box store where all those folks have to cover their overhead and their big buildings and their big staffs and things. And so the farmer or the maker is getting just a few cents on the dollar that it's being sold for. So we're doing a lot of talk about that.
I actually am working on a book though not as diligently as I should be but you know watch out for a kitchen confidential of farmers markets coming up pretty soon
Yes. Amazing. Well, Kat, it's always so wonderful to have you here. are just, I mean, you're older than me, so I'm allowed to say I want to be Catt Fields-White when I grow up. I just think you are an absolute force of nature, creating so much good in this world. If you are listening and you don't follow Kat, please do. You get to see how she loves on her grandkids and her family and all the work that she's doing between San Diego and Philadelphia.
So I love that you're on the East Coast too. I'm from Pennsylvania, as many people know. So I love that you're there.
I have such a good time and honestly East coasters are a little suspicious of Californians So I have I have actually gotten to dig in and work a lot with farmers market and farmers market people in the East Coast Since I've had that Philadelphia base. I think they think a little more seriously
I love it. Well, thank you, Kat. We will have links and information for the Intense Conference, which is happening in March, right? Do you want to throw out the date?
Yeah, it's March 1st through 4th. I mean the good thing to know now is that the RFP is open. So if you are in this world and you have something to share, some innovative thing that you're doing or join the panel to talk about how your business has been affected by farmers markets, now is the time. It's conferenceRFP.com. What kind of domain holder holds that name? I was good at that one. So it's easy to remember conferenceRFP.com if you want to submit a proposal to speak at the Intense Conference. That's coming up.
Early bird tickets are still on sale through September and we would love to see you there. Follow us at farmersmarketforum.com. I got to say we do have a mutual admiration society here. You are a baby compared to me so I can't grow up to be you but I really appreciate what you do especially in terms of this last year where you've been talking to people about the realities of scaling. We don't think scaling is for everybody or scaling beyond a certain point is for everybody and we think that often
really big scaling benefits the folks at the top of that chain, not the actual maker. And you have done such good work, Sarah, kind of explaining and to an extent exposing what that system is and how it doesn't necessarily benefit makers. And we really appreciate that.
Thank you, it's an honor to hear that from you. So I appreciate it. Thank you, Kat. We'll see you again soon, I'm sure.
Obviously.
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